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Thread: Healthcare Reform Kills Finland Government

  1. #1
    Member Tim Steelersfan's Avatar

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    Healthcare Reform Kills Finland Government

    Nothing to see here folks, move along, just a country failing due to healthcare reform.

    Finland’s government collapses over failed health care reform

    Finland's Prime Minister Juha Sipilä resigned Friday morning, one month ahead of an election.

    "The social welfare and health care reform was one of our government's most important objectives," Sipilä said at a press briefing. "The snapshot of the situation that I got from the parliament obliged me to examine if there was a possibility of continuing the reform process. There wasn't."

    "My conclusion was that my government had to hand in our note of resignation," he added. "I take my responsibility."

    Finland has a decentralized system of health and social welfare programs, where much of the administration is left to local municipalities. This arrangement has led to widespread geographic variation when it comes to quality and access to health care services.

    The reform was meant to address these inequalities and reduce the growing cost of the country's health care system, which has come under increasing stress from an ageing population. It included centralization of the administration at a regional level.

    Last month, Sipilä spoke to POLITICO about the “very difficult” social and health care changes, calling them the country’s “biggest reform since the Second World War.”

    “The publicity and discussion and debate during the process we have had in Finland, it has been painful, and it shows that people are afraid of change,” he said.

    There has been general agreement among political parties of the need to reform the system. However, the parties differ when it comes to the finer details, which has led to the current impasse.

    Sipilä’s Center Party had agreed to some reforms pushed for by the center-right National Coalition Party that would allow for more privatization of health care services, but this move was fiercely opposed by the left-leaning and Green parties, Laura Kalliomaa-Puha, a professor of social welfare law at Tampere University, said.

    “It has been politically extremely difficult,” Kalliomaa-Puha said.

    “Prime Minister Sipilä will request to resign because the health care reform cannot be accomplished during this government term,” Antti Kaikkonen, the head of Sipilä’s Center Party’s parliamentary group wrote on Twitter. He added: "If anyone asks what political responsibility means, then I would say this is an example of that."

    According to local media, President Sauli Niinistö asked Sipilä to remain in office as a caretaker PM until an April 14 parliamentary election.
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  2. #2
    What's the link?

  3. #3
    Senor Blues Roy92040's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djfan View Post
    What's the link?
    Here's one https://www.politico.eu/article/finl...h-care-reform/
    Well Yippy Skippy - Author Unknown

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  4. #4
    It just proves there is no "magic" way to pay for healthcare.

    The bottom line is we want more than we can afford. We all want Mercedes care, the best and newest tech, the best off-the-research table medicines, the best doctors but we expect to pay Honda prices.

    All politicians are just playing shell games around this vital point. We either, as a culture, accept average day-to-day care and old drugs that have worked for decades or we continue to fight over who is going to pay for it.

  5. #5
    The best healthcare you can get is by taking good care of yourself in life. Instill it in your children. At the rate this self absorbed obese population is going no amount of insurance will fix what's broken.

    That's the real change needed. If that happens they'll be plenty for those who are truly sick not of their own doing.

    If we don't focus on preventive through education and activity then 50% of this population will be diabetic in 20 years.

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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelr4evr View Post
    The best healthcare you can get is by taking good care of yourself in life. Instill it in your children. At the rate this self absorbed obese population is going no amount of insurance will fix what's broken.

    That's the real change needed. If that happens they'll be plenty for those who are truly sick not of their own doing.

    If we don't focus on preventive through education and activity then 50% of this population will be diabetic in 20 years.
    And seriously, the food supply in this nation is garbage. We really need to return to healthier foods and no processed crap. I am the furthest thing from a hippie you will ever meet, but our food supply is destroyed.

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  7. #7
    Member Tim Steelersfan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Djfan View Post
    What's the link?
    Click the title in the post, it's hyperlinked
    "White, Christian, right-wing America is not real America." - Tibs

    "I’ve handled LR .22 bullets, I also shot a semi-automatic 30-30." - Trogolodyte

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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelr4evr View Post
    The best healthcare you can get is by taking good care of yourself in life. Instill it in your children. At the rate this self absorbed obese population is going no amount of insurance will fix what's broken.

    That's the real change needed. If that happens they'll be plenty for those who are truly sick not of their own doing.

    If we don't focus on preventive through education and activity then 50% of this population will be diabetic in 20 years.
    I think there is a strong argument to be made we go back 50 years to the way medicine was done.

    You family doctor was a "family doctor". He didn't cost a lot but he didn't offer ANY bells or whistles. You went to an office attached to his house. There was one nurse because there was no need for crazy insurance and paperwork. Every patient had a file. That was it. Your doctor knew your name. Knew you from town.

    There is SO much that can be handled this way. 95% of medicine for people under the age of 50 should be this and only this. Just think how much this would "save" vs. the conglomerate of hospitals and doctors "practices" owned by corporations.

    We need to realize that medicine can be compartmentalized. It's not all under the same umbrella or needs to be the same expensive shit in each phase.

    You have normal, everyday crap. You get sick. You need checkups. Routine care. Should be beyond cheap.

    Then there is ER stuff. Again, free market has actually HELPED lower costs of the ER. We have specialized emergency room type places to go that can deal with most "emergencies" that aren't life/death. You cut yourself. You need stitches. An illergic reaction.

    Then you have out-patience specialized care. This is where I think the for-profit hospitals and insurance companiers are raping us. Some of the "costs" associated with this are outrageous.

    Then you have over-night stays in hospitals and high-end surgeries. It's expensive. You want the best care. Maybe this part could be nationalized. Maybe this could be streamlined to kick out all the bullshit and extras.

    Then you have end-of-life care and chronic diseases that take multiple treatments. 90% of this is already nationized because most end-of-life care happens while under Medicare/Medicaid.

    There has to be a better way than to look at all these "groups" of completely difference services and call them all "healthcare" and not think outside the box a bit on what we want to pay for.

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  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelr4evr View Post
    The best healthcare you can get is by taking good care of yourself in life. Instill it in your children. At the rate this self absorbed obese population is going no amount of insurance will fix what's broken.

    That's the real change needed. If that happens they'll be plenty for those who are truly sick not of their own doing.

    If we don't focus on preventive through education and activity then 50% of this population will be diabetic in 20 years.
    There are, at least 2 meds i could stop taking if i exercised and ate better. Like many Americans, i take a pill instead.

    On the plus side, the meds i take are older generics that don't have 10 pages of side effects.

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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelr4evr View Post
    The best healthcare you can get is by taking good care of yourself in life. Instill it in your children. At the rate this self absorbed obese population is going no amount of insurance will fix what's broken.

    That's the real change needed. If that happens they'll be plenty for those who are truly sick not of their own doing.

    If we don't focus on preventive through education and activity then 50% of this population will be diabetic in 20 years.
    Quote Originally Posted by Djfan View Post
    And seriously, the food supply in this nation is garbage. We really need to return to healthier foods and no processed crap. I am the furthest thing from a hippie you will ever meet, but our food supply is destroyed.
    I've been to Italy. Given all the awesome food, pizza, and pasta, you see almost no overweight people. For one thing, pretty much all the food is organic, not marketed as such, that's just how it's done. Food is relatively expensive over there, as is gas, so most people walk a lot. We averaged 8 to 10 miles a day as tourists, ate a ton of pizza and pasta, and we all came home with our belts a notch tighter.
    Last edited by Ron Burgundy; 08-19-2019 at 07:15 AM.
    "It is not the multitude of ale houses that occasions a disposition to drunkenness among the common people; but that disposition arising from other causes necessarily gives employment to a multitude of ale houses." -- Adam Smith, 1776

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  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy View Post
    I've been to Italy. Given all the awesome food, pizza, and pasta, you see almost no overweight people. For one thing, pretty much all the food is organic, not marketed as such, that's just how it's done. Food is relatively expensive over there, as is gas, so most people walk a lot. We averaged 8 to 10 miles a day as tourists.
    Italy is sn excellent example of locally sourced, organic, heirloom food supply. We left that right after the war in Europe, and look at us now. The garbage we call food is criminal.

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    Ron needs to take Ark's bloated ass to Eyetully

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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Superman View Post
    Ron needs to take Ark's bloated ass to Eyetully
    And leave it there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elfiero View Post
    Of course I'm despicable...

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  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy View Post
    I've been to Italy. Given all the awesome food, pizza, and pasta, you see almost no overweight people. For one thing, pretty much all the food is organic, not marketed as such, that's just how it's done. Food is relatively expensive over there, as is gas, so most people walk a lot. We averaged 8 to 10 miles a day as tourists, ate a ton of pizza and pasta, and we all came home with our belts a notch tighter.
    I grew up on a farm in western pa. All i knew was organic for the first 15 years of life. I also knew insane hard work . All activities had a physical element because I'd have to hike it or bike it to reach whatever i wanted to do.

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    Member hamster's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by deljzc View Post
    I think there is a strong argument to be made we go back 50 years to the way medicine was done.

    You family doctor was a "family doctor". He didn't cost a lot but he didn't offer ANY bells or whistles. You went to an office attached to his house. There was one nurse because there was no need for crazy insurance and paperwork. Every patient had a file. That was it. Your doctor knew your name. Knew you from town.
    I remember people smoking in the waiting room of my family doctor, as a kid. They had ash trays scattered about.
    You lost. Get over it.

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  16. #16
    I remember seeing football players smoke cigarettes on the sidelines during games

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Djfan View Post
    And seriously, the food supply in this nation is garbage. We really need to return to healthier foods and no processed crap. I am the furthest thing from a hippie you will ever meet, but our food supply is destroyed.
    Since switching to organic bread, eliminating chips and soda. I agree.
    But cheap, processed food is marketed towards lower income families. It’s like they have no choice. It really is all these sustainable, cheap and processed ingredients

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  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by MTC View Post
    Since switching to organic bread, eliminating chips and soda. I agree.
    But cheap, processed food is marketed towards lower income families. It’s like they have no choice. It really is all these sustainable, cheap and processed ingredients
    Only because ssome don't know how to do it differently, or choose not to. Local produce, home grown foods, and local meats are actually cheaper once up and running. Some people can eat very well at about 50 cents per person, per meal. Beats that $5 heart attack at mickey Ds.

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    MTC


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    Quote Originally Posted by MTC View Post
    Since switching to organic bread, eliminating chips and soda. I agree.
    But cheap, processed food is marketed towards lower income families. It’s like they have no choice. It really is all these sustainable, cheap and processed ingredients
    It is expensive to eat healthy. It is cheap to eat badly.
    "It is not the multitude of ale houses that occasions a disposition to drunkenness among the common people; but that disposition arising from other causes necessarily gives employment to a multitude of ale houses." -- Adam Smith, 1776

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  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by hamster View Post
    I remember people smoking in the waiting room of my family doctor, as a kid. They had ash trays scattered about.
    When I was a kid, my family doctor would smoke during appointments. Doc McNeil. He even wore one of those mirror/reflector thingy's on his head.

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